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TOPIC: Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program

Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 3 months ago #24455

I think that the above commentaries/discussions are educational. One could think that the past attemtps at organizing grower's associations were enough of an effort, however successful/unsuccessful they may have been.

However the crux is this [IMHO]: that the regulations are continuing to be in all of our faces. It seems to me that there is no hiding from it a'tall.

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 3 months ago #24463

I agree Whitjr.

I think one of the bigger issues is that we must all come to the understanding that the days of unregulated harvest are now over. There will always be regulations with which we must now contend. Personally I believe there are some regulations in Ohio which are totally ridiculous. I fully understand that the state of Ohio and the ginseng program team are trying to comply with the federal requirements and the only possible solution is to either cause the USFWS to change their requirements, or otherwise broker a better -more sensible and less ponderous- interpretation of those requirements by the state.

Specifically, I am now required to record harvesting information, not just buying information. It has been required now for years that diggers keep track of their harvests by day and county. The state requires a weight of ginseng harvested -regardless of the fact that the weight changes by the hour until dry, and then still can change with atmospheric conditions.

So lets say a digger harvests 2oz on 9/1, 4 oz on 9/2, and another 3oz on 9/2 in a different county. The way it is now, instead of writing down all of the digger's information (address, name, county etc) and the date of harvest as 9/1-2/13 with a separate entry for the second county, I must now completely fill out three separate entries with all of the separate information.


Stuff like that and definitions I am hopeful can be changed. Additionally, I would like to see some consistency between the states laws so that each grower has an equal shot at what he must do or not do to comply with the laws.

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 3 months ago #24520

Hey Folks,

I just wanted to let you all know that Brad and I talked on the phone for a little over 2 hours yesterday and came to terms on the direction of any possible association or organization for the smaller growers, diggers and the Ginseng Dealers will take. As in most disagreements over the internet, it mainly came down to misunderstanding and misinterpretation of what each other wrote!

As Brad wrote, the days of harvesting, buying and selling Wild Ginseng and possibly even growing, buying and selling of Wild-Simulated or Woodsgrown Ginseng unregulated, are long gone! We all must face this realization and be willing to do everything we possibly can to insure that any regulating of any of these, will not adversely affect them and what we love to do. However, we must understand that after all the work and efforts that we and others do, Wild Ginseng harvesting, buying and selling may eventually become outlawed. While trying to prevent this from happening, we must at the same time, concentrate efforts to protect the growing of Wild-Simulated and Woodsgrown Ginseng and the small-time growers of these. It is our hopes and I am sure the hopes of everyone on here, that Wild Ginseng harvesting, buying and selling will never be outlawed and that any laws concerning it, will not adversely affect Wild-Simulated and Woodsgrown Ginseng and the growers of such!

Whether you are just a Wild Ginseng Digger that practices good stewardship or a Wild Ginseng Digger that practices good stewardship but also purchases and plants Wild-Simulated and/or Woodsgrown Ginseng seeds or rootlets or you are mainly a small-time grower of the latter two, it is time for us to band together in a common cause! Please consider this, discuss this with other Ginseng Diggers/Growers that you may know and are not members of Wildgrown or do not have online access and try to get as many folks as you possibly can to come onboard, if and when an association or organization gets off the ground. The main reasons that other Ginseng Digger/Growers associations have failed, is mainly due to the wide diversity of the members and possible members, members being widely spread, lack of technology (especially for some in Appalachia), disagreements on direction and mission and sometimes the costs of membership to maintain such an association. We all must work together and individually to overcome any and or all of these problems! Hopefully in the very near future, a poll for creating such an association or organization will be posted here on the forums and will include the question: whether you are willing to become a member or whether you are not willing to become a member. I hope most will answer that you are willing to become a member as any possible association or organization will need as many members as possible to make this work!

A lot of work must be done! First, we must work to get a voice with those folks, agencies or entities that count (i.e. make the decisions, regulations and laws and those who create the input to either of these) whether it be at the local, State or the Federal level. Second, we must work to educate, inform and convince the folks that make decisions on regulating Ginseng (i.e. politicians, ecologists, scientists, etc.) that together, we can make a difference and save Wild Ginseng. Third, we also need to educate and inform Wild-Simulated and/or Woodsgrown Growers and even the Diggers of the laws and regulations, especially any new ones of which they may be unaware of and also on the practices of good stewardship. Fourth, we all need to work to stop Ginseng poaching on any and all lands whether they are private, public or Federally protected. Work to stop the harvesting of the roots of immature plants (i.e. flat tops, two prongs and even immature or young three prongs) and to stop the Ginseng Dealers that have done so and still purchase these roots of immature plants and resell those roots to a specific customer base. Without a market for these roots, hopefully poachers and others that dig the roots of immature plants, would no longer have a reason to dig them! Fifth, we must work to get each and every State where Wild Ginseng is harvested to more align their' Wild Ginseng Harvesting, buying and selling laws and regulations. However, we must at the same time, understand that some states have shorter growing seasons and earlier Fall cold weather than some others and thus, they must maintain an earlier Ginseng Season than these others. Also, we must get any states that have regulations and/or laws such as requiring Ginseng Diggers to log entries of daily harvests (which includes the date, the poundage and the county in which it was harvested) and thus a similar requirement of the Ginseng Dealers within these states, to do away with such ludicrous laws or regulations. The main concern is not to know where each and every root came from within a state and the exact dates and poundage but to know whether it was harvested during the current year or previous year, the total poundage and whether it was harvested on private or public lands! While harvests by individual counties may be great in determining stats for each county, these requirements are too time and cost intensive for everyone involved!

Please consider all of these things and if you have any ideas, suggestions or disagreements with anything, post them here so that they can be considered and discussed. We really need everyone's input and insight!

Thanks and please excuse any typing mistakes or redundancy!


Frank

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24534

Hey Folks,

After writing the previous post and having time to reflect on it, I just wanted to clarify some things! When Brad and I talked, we agreed that he would pursue any possible startup of an association or organization through his contacts. He has more experience and knowledge of what may be needed and required since he is already involved with growing Wild-Simulated and Woodsgrown Ginseng as well as being a Steward of Wild Ginseng. As agreed, I will do some research and pursue some contacts for information and help as time permits and we will use these, if they are needed or the situation warrants.

Besides Brad having the knowledge, experience and contacts within the market, he is probably better suited to head this venture up due to the following reasons! I will be very busy until at least the end of the year as I am having to clear out many years of hoarding stuff and do some repairs on my' home as my oldest daughter and her 5 children (my grandchildren) will be moving in with me and my middle daughter by the end of October. Along with these things that have to get done, I run a small business, Ginseng Season is in and Deer and Boar Seasons are rapidly approaching. I am also scheduled for a Gold prospecting trip along with 3 other individuals. During this trip, I am both teaching them Gold prospecting but getting their help in excavating a creek bed to reopen the flow of an underground stream which appears to be flowing through an eroding volcanic pipe and comes up in the stream where we will be working. I also have quite a few other projects through the end of this year besides having several Doctors appointments as follow-ups due to me suffering 4 heart attacks back in April. Please understand that while the last heart attack I had on April 30th (which put me in the hospital for three days) was the worst, none were really bad and they were more of a wake-up call to change my lifestyle and eating habits. My' heart suffered bruising but the EKG's and Heart Catheterization showed that there was no damage. I just have to follow the Doctor's orders and stay on my' meds.

In closing I will say, that it was my hopes that a few folks would have responded to my post by now with advice, suggestions, information or even criticism! However, I know that many of you work and that you are also trying to find time to get in a little Ginseng hunting and digging, so maybe some will find time to post their comments in the near future. I also wanted to let Brad know, that if there is anything in my previous post that he deems is not correct or should not be in the post, to please let me know. I want to work with Brad and everyone here on this venture or project and not against anyone!

Thanks!


Frank

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24536

Frank, I'm a hoarded too soooo if you have any good stuff let me know.:cheer:

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24537

We should hook up and go hook up on some stripe sometime!

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24542

rickyc wrote:

Frank, I'm a hoarded too soooo if you have any good stuff let me know.:cheer:


You wouldn't believe all of the stuff I have hoarded over the years! I have hundreds of pounds of rocks some with gems in them but most not that I have collected during Gem and Gold prospecting trips. I have lots of coins, collectibles and lots of other items such as valuable bronze and mixed-media sculptures of Native American Indians and Wolves, 10 metal detectors, lots of guns, nuts and bolts from just about everything I dismantled or replaced over the years and a lot of whatnot. My' Gold prospecting equipment alone takes up a quarter of my' two car garage. Where do you start whe clearing out sooo many years of clutter and what were, will do projects that never came to be??!!

rickyc wrote:

We should hook up and go hook up on some stripe sometime!


I don't have a boat, so you would have to bring one! The pic showing me with the two Hybrid Bass was taken on my friend's boat and I never know if and when he is going out to fish. We only sporadically stay in touch and I have not heard from him in a month or more! I think that the put the area around the Cherokee Dam off-limits, am not sure if it has been lifted and this is one of the best places to catch the big Stripers. They apparently wait very close to the dam's spillways or other outflows for bait fish that get caught in the current. Pretty smart huh??!!


Frank

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24549

Frank
Where were you able to prospect. I ran my keene 6\" on the North Fork of the Yuba in northern CA for most of 2008 before and during the moratorium. I sure would love to get it back out again.
Scott From WV

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24550

WVwhitewolf wrote:

Frank
Where were you able to prospect. I ran my keene 6\" on the North Fork of the Yuba in northern CA for most of 2008 before and during the moratorium. I sure would love to get it back out again.
Scott From WV


Scott,

I mainly Gold prospect in Southeast Tennessee not too far from Coker Creek where the first Gold strike was made in the State! I also occasionally go to North Carolina not too far South of Marion. Are you a member of the LDMA and GPAA or just GPAA? I used to go with a friend who is a member of the LDMA to a LDMA claim in North Carolina and I found a spot woith a lot of Gold. He won't go back there due to having a Copperhead and Black Snake come past us while they were fighting a life and death fight.


Frank

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Re:Ginseng Poaching Featuered on CBS This Morning Program 4 years 2 months ago #24561

I am not understanding what benefit there would be in having a growers/diggers association. i do see a benefit in a growers association.
As a grower i have spent many dollars and many hours growing wild-simulated ginseng, The days of hunting ginseng on public lands, parks ect... are rapidly becoming endangered, just like the plant itself, as a grower how does this affect me? it doesn't.
It only affects the digger. why? because the digger in his past actions has been a very unreliable steward of ginseng. Only when something is taken away, people want to start trying to do the right thing. Face it, we live in a world where everybody wants everything for free....no cost, no personal sacrifice. If an organization was started where the digger was required to buy 3 pounds of ginseng seed per year and send those seeds to a grower not of his choice but of the organizations choice to remain a member how many diggers would be members? my guess is very few. In my opinion Banning ginseng hunting on public lands is the most effective way to stabilize the wild ginseng population. the parks were intended to be for everyones enjoyment, visual enjoyment. Not a personal piggy-bank of the people living on the borders of the park. Face it guys, the cows drying up, the pigss teets are empty now, If you are going to continue to hunt ginseng, better learn how to grow it.

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