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Post your experiences, questions and answers about growing wild-simulated ginseng
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TOPIC: Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild

Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35492

It has been some time since we here on the forum refreshed our opinions on these topics. We've had several new members join up, and i understand the \"lurker's\" numbers have also gone up. I suspect that the newer members have been reading the different ratings of \"woods-grown\", \"wild-simulated,\" and \"wild\" with some different ideas about the method.

I know that this is old hat for all you tenured members, however am asking you experienced folks especially to voice opinions about these important distinctions.

Important distinctions as these contribute to the ethics of our business, what is sold as what, how it is grown in order to sell as what, etc...

Shade grown is pretty much defined as grown under erected artificial shade, in a chem-laced dirt especially done for the needs of the plant. Pretty obvious, yes? Grows unique-colored carrot looking 'sang.

Also pretty obvious is the \"wild\" distinction... gathered from the wild only.

Where it gets fuzzy for some is the \"woods-grown\" and \"Wild-sim\" methods.

Please post your opinion. Thanks in advance!

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35496

Each state may have a little different interpretation on wild simulated but here is my take on the subject.

Wild simulated is no more than raking the leaves back,scattering some seed and cover it with the leaves. You walk away and let nature take its course.

On woods grown, there are probably different degrees you could take it to on amendments and fungicides.

There was a guy several years ago in the Red River Gorge in KY. that grew what he called virtually wild ginseng where he he planted one seed at a time poking 1/2 inch holes with a stick.

But like Hillhopper stated, To make any real money it has to be woodsgrown and taken care of. If the roots look good they will still bring premium prices.

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35501

I agree with Rootman for the most part. Here is my opinion.

Wild...naturally occurring (as far as we know anyway...different topic)

Wild simulated ...you plant the seed, or rootlet, and leave them be. No soil amendments and no helping out...spray or weeding and NO fertilizers or growth enhancers.

Woodsgrown ...may be raised in tilled beds, soil may be amended, and spray may be used ...however NO fertilizers or growth enhancers are used.

Cultivated .... Any mechanical growing method...under natural OR artificial shade in which fertilizers or any growth enhancers are used.

In Ohio we have two classifications...wild and cultivated. Wild sim by legal definition is wild here.

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35502

Thanks for the responses so far!!! nice to have the responses from both dealers and growers... How about the rest of you growers and diggers on this website... anyone else have an opinion that is useful for this post?

Yeah, the wild-sim statements above,,, that's where some folks think it gets a bit fuzzy. In the past there has been a real debate on these points.

For example... I've heard that -paticularily on the wild-sim--- that organic soil amendments can be used on these plantings. However no pesticides/herbicides/or non-organic fertilizers at all.

If you spread the seed, and then walk away for the growth period of the next 10 years... how is that different from wild? Seems to me that this step, required by law in more than a few states is no different than wild category. That is, some states require that you replant seeds within a small range of the \"naturally-occuring\" wild plant. One could argue that there are very, very few naturally-occuring plants out there given the near decimation of ginseng due to poor harvest practices for the past 200 years, resulting in it's mostly endangered status.

It would be nice to have some official input here from, say, someone in the NC Dept of Ag, or the Kentucky Dept of Ag.... I think both those depts are monitoring this website... I would like to get folks engaged with the definitions here. Perhaps some buyers can weigh in as well... I believe that this website is monitored by many buyers as well...

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35504

I'm pretty sure once the soil is tilled in Ohio it is considered cultivated. So the woodsgrown by Ohio definition fits into cultivated being it isn't by any definition wild and we only have two classifications. I believe that should make it legal to harvest and sell rootlets (interstate) from tilled beds as well as harvesting seeds to sell or plant where one desires and not be stuck with planting the seeds \"near\" the mother plant like we have to with our planted wild simulated.

Jim

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35505

Whitjr:
I thought this was funny. \"It would be nice to have some official input here from, say, someone in the NC Dept of Ag, or the Kentucky Dept of Ag.... I think both those depts are monitoring this website... \". I would think that every state (and fed) has someone monitoring this site. They're just lurkers.

Jim

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35506

In my opinion:

Wild = plants grown under wild conditions from seed acquired from local plants.The method of seed transport (animal, human, bird, water) is irrelevant.

Wild sim = plants grown under wild conditions from seed acquired from non local source and introduced by human activity.

Woods grown= plants grown under controlled conditions under natural canopy regardless of seed source.


In my opinion, protection of the plants from animal predation does not count since it has no effect on growth , only on survivability.

Good Luck

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35507

I have planted some seed and some rootlets in the woods, let them grow on their own with absolutely zero help from me, wild-sim I would say? now some of these have dropped seeds and I now have sang growing from the seeds that dropped, is this wild sang? or still wild-sim? I am going to dig a few to transplant and will post pics of them, see if a difference can be seen in them. I agree that woods grown has to do with helping the plants and amending the soil. I have also been told by some experienced diggers that you can tell a difference in the roots by the growth rings on the neck, simulated the rings will not be a complete ring around the neck, anyone ever heard this before?
thanks

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35512

jimsenger66 wrote:

I'm pretty sure once the soil is tilled in Ohio it is considered cultivated. So the woodsgrown by Ohio definition fits into cultivated being it isn't by any definition wild and we only have two classifications. I believe that should make it legal to harvest and sell rootlets (interstate) from tilled beds as well as harvesting seeds to sell or plant where one desires and not be stuck with planting the seeds \"near\" the mother plant like we have to with our planted wild simulated.

Jim



Jimsenger, I want to preface this by saying that I am not an attorney nor any other kind of legal expert, but it is my understanding that you ONLY have to plant seeds or berries by the \"mother\" plant IF you harvest said mother plant. If you do not dig the mother plant then you are free to plant the berries or seed wherever you choose....
The only mention of planting seeds that I am aware of in Ohio laws is about the seeds from plants that are harvested....

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Re:Poll: on the definitions of woods-grown, wild-sim and wild 2 years 5 months ago #35513

Now to answer the question of this thread...

Wild ginseng = ginseng that for all perceivable purposes is naturally occurring and shows no sign of human intervention.

Wild simulated = ginseng that
has been planted by human hands, but otherwise is left to fend for itself in the wild.

Woodsgrown = ginseng that is planted in a woodland environmen, but is helped along the way... I believe that this category covers a widwide
area and yields quite a variety of different quality Of roots, from some that are pretty much indistinguishable from wild ginseng to roots that look very much like cultivated ginseng based on the methods used... Fungicides, fertilizer fertilizers, planted in tilled soil, etc...

Cultivated = ginseng that is planted in tilled soil, and is typically grown under shade cloth and heavy use of fungicides is typically used.


No matter how you slice it up there are typically some overlaps....
Those overlaps by my definition are typically lumed into the Woodsgrown category

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