TOPIC: Wet and Matted Leaf Problem

I posted this under another thread already. But I hope this can help anyone facing the same problem so I created a new thread.


WET AND MATTED LEAF PROBLEM STORY BELOW FROM TODAY.
If anyone is interested, I learned a lesson today. I checked one of my ginseng beds at my woods we own that is 84 miles from where I live now while visiting for Easter.

My 2 year old ginseng is coming up nicely and resembles many seedling pics being posted recently. However, I notices it was a little thinner than last year. We have had record breaking rain fall this April and the leaves are wet and matted down. I suspected with the leaves being so wet and heavy that some of the plants may be having a difficult time finding a gap to poke through. The leaves are from Ash, Hickory and Beech so they are not big like Oak leaves. But they are still wet and heavy and many plant tops are developed but growing sideways looking for a way through the matted leaves. Many are simply just curling over under the leaves because they cannot lift the wet leaves up.

I took the leaves off of a 4 foot by 4 foot spot and exposed many plant tops that could not poke through. I am certain that these plants under the leaves that have not made their way through will eventually run out of energy to find their way through. It was very disappointing to say the least and is driving me crazy.

I know many of us have discussed carefully raking at least 50 % of the leaves off the planting bed a couple of weeks prior to the plants popping up. I wish I would have done this.

So I called Larry this evening and asked him what I should do. He said it would be good to carefully lift up the excess leaves to help the plants. Unfortunately I will not be able to get back over to do that. He said their is a good chance that these two year olds will go dormant if they cannot make it through and will come up next year. I am fine with this and it makes me feel a bit better. I will rake some leaves off Next March before this happens again next spring.

The bad news is if these were seeds just planted last fall that they will not come up the following year if they do not make it through this spring and very soon. This is disturbing since I have planted a large quantity last fall and early winter.

I am going to go to my newly planted sites and carefully lift off the wet leaves with a four prong pitch fork. I do not want to lose 20 lbs of newly planted seeds.

He also said that the rain and moisture will protect the plants under the matted leaves for now. But it will increase my survival rate substantially if I can get the excess leaves off.

Record rains were unexpected and anyone faced with the same problem might want to consider this.

I guess I will be doing this next weekend verses mushroom hunting. Oh well, learning the hard way but I do not think it is too late to correct the problem. It's just going to really take a while but worth it.

Next year I will not let this happen again. I am going to mulch the leaves before I put them back on the beds after planting. He also recommended I consider using straw or composted sawdust or a combination of both to prevent this from happening again.

I think I will stick with mulching the leaves in the woods. I know I have stated this before but I have an old self propelled mulching mower that I am going to use from now on.

Live and learn I guess. I hope this does not happen to anyone else.
Latt

Latt

I have had the same problem with wet matted leaves over the years. I usually have only a problem in small areas of some beds. I take a three prong hand cultivator and lift off the wet leaves and fluff them up and then replace them back over the soil. I do this every year right after the snow is off the beds. Then the beds can start airing out. Also wet matted leaves is prime habitat for slugs and snails.

Years ago I found areas of wet matted leaves, and saw that the seedlings were growing under the the wet leaves, just as you described. The seedlings will grow long and lanky and will be yellow, not green. I believe that the snow is what causes the leaves to become matted.

I have made it a habit to clear up these matted leaf areas ASAP in the spring before the seeds germinate.

This year I removed all the leaves on the seed beds, so I could apply Plant Helper directly to the soil. and also applied Deadline for the slugs.

It's frustrating.

classicfur

Classicfur and Latt...

Sounds like a real pain to have to deal with that.

Classicfur I remember seeing a pic you posted a few weeks ago of when the snow was just meliting off there and revealing patches of leaves and man they were flattened out from all of that heavy snow being on top all winter.

Fortunately I don't have that problem here. We just don't get that much snow and it is usually only a few inches when we do get it and it only last a few days before it melts.

I tell you one thing I would hate to have to get out there and try to remove the leaves in the spring or remove most and fluff up the rest.

Once I plant them - I really just don't want to mess with the planting beds other than perhaps broadcasting more gypsum.

I think I would look into some option like using straw for mulch, or mulching up the leaves and applying a couple inches of leaf mulch, or you could always mulch leaves and straw together and use that.

I guess either way you go it's going to be some extra work but sure sounds like it is going to be necessary in areas where you have thick leaf cover and all that snow mashing them down flat all winter.

Good Luck with whatever you do to help !

TNhunter

TNhunter

I guess you do what you gotta do.

For some it's setting up watering system to keep plants from dying in the summer and for others dealing with matted leaves.

Matted leaf areas usually are dealt with in an hour or two. I'm not too concerned with it.

classicfur

If you have updates for us, please don't hesitate to let us know how this is going.

I'm headed back up this weekend.... and will look some more keeping this in mind. There are some areas in some of the beds that I will look at , however I don't think that I will have the same extensive problem that you have, Latt.

Has anyone tried using a leaf blower to suck the leaves up and mulch them?

Koolrayz,
I have tried this with dry leaves in the woods when planting 3 years ago, but it takes forever. I even tried removing the bag and putting a dryer vent on the leaf blower/shredder so I wouldn't have to empty the bag every 5 minutes. I aimed the vent so they would shoot out over the planted bed. It worked OK at best. I think picking up the bigger sticks first then mulching the leaves with a mulching mower is the way to go. I am going to rake the leaves to the side as always and then mulch them with the mower thus shooting the pieces back over the planted bed. Can't run the mower across the bed once the seeds are planted thou due to the possibility of chopping all the seeds up.

I saw where you posted you are from Central Ohio. I am West of Columbus. Which direction are you?
Thanks,
Latt

I live southwest of mansfield. Actually about 5 miles southwest of mid-0hio sports car course

Latt

I have tried mulching my leaves with a lawn mower and found to get good germination with that method. But for the past four years I have just used whole leaves 1\" thick in spring and have had 80% or higher germination rate. Its not worth my time to shred the leaves when I get that high of germination rate. But shredded leaves do work well.

In your case it's probably better to mulch the leaves to keep them from getting trapped. For me it's never been a huge job to correct problems like that since I only plant 2-4 lbs of seed at a time. I have never attempted to plant the volume of seeds that you have planted

The one thing I have done every year before the seedlings emerge is to check under the mulch every few days to see how they are doing. Perhaps I have disturbed them more than neccessary. But it has not prevented them from producing great germination rate. Since I live in the north, I put a heavy layer of mulch on when I plant seeds to protect/prevent frost heaves. Then in the spring I remove most of the mulch to allow the seedlings to emerge. See pg 111 in Persons book. Any way, by checking under the mulch regularly I am able to prevented some disasters before they get out of control.

Perhaps the lawn mower thing will do the trick for you.

Hang in there!

classicfur

Classicfur,
I will do either the rake off or the mulched leaves method this fall. I just got caught by all this rain this April. I hunted mushrooms in the rain again tonight. The woods are soaked. The leaves are so matted down an have been wet for the entire month. Its going to rain everyday this week again.
I have never had problems with matted leaves before but I sure did learn something new this April.
It will be interesting to see if some of these plant tops from the new seeds can worm their way through the matted leaves.
I have to be careful not to kill the seedlings if I do take some leaves off. I am tempted to let mother nature run it course. I would hate to kill the plants by accident or make things worse. It is possible the plant tops could be caught in the leaf litter and if I lift the leaves off I could snap the stem and kill the ginseng seedlings.
I think I am talking myself into letting it work itself out.
I am not usually indecisive, but ginseng can do that to a fella.
Latt